河里人第5次AMA回顾|你知道你的NFT藏品有多稀有吗?

Rivermen NFT
30 min readJan 14, 2022

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Rivermen AMA 05 review|Do you know how rare your NFT collections are?

2021年,是疯狂的“NFT年”,在这一年里催生出了大量的NFT项目。

目前的NFT市场大部分是围绕者数字艺术、卡片、和稀有物品等收藏品展开叙事。尤其是NFT收藏品的稀有属性,更是推动着NFT市场的热潮。

那么如何评估NFT收藏品的稀有性呢?

本次河里人社区AMA特地邀请到NFTGo的市场负责人Venus,在推特Space上和大家共同探讨如何评估NFT藏品的稀有性。

2021 is a big year for NFTs when a large number of NFT projects came out.

Many of the current NFTs tell stories revolving around collections such as digital art, cards, and rare objects. In particular, the rarity of NFT collections is driving the upsurge of NFTs prices.

The thing is how do we evaluate the rarity of an NFT collection?

Rivermen draw Venus this time, the marketing leader of NFTGo, to discuss how to evaluate the rarity of the NFT collections through Twitter Space.

以下为AMA内容回顾:

Reviews are as follow

Venus:

大家好,我是NFTGo的市场负责人Venus。NFTGo巨鲸追踪和稀有度查询功能,希望大家可以通过使用 NFTGo 捕捉市场机会,快速获得财富密码

Venus:

Hi, guys. I’m the marketing director of NFTGo which features whale tracking and rarity ranking functions. I hope NFTGo can help you guys to capture market opportunities and quickly get rich.

Nova:目前市场上有很多统计和查询NFT 稀有度的工具,那NFTGo 的这个功能和其他同类型功能有什么差异点吗?

Nova: There are a lot of tools on the market to rank the rarity of NFTs. What’s the differentiation between NFTGo and other similar tools?

Venus:

NFTGo的这个信用查询的数据算法模型是我们自己自研的, 个人认为Rarity.tools 是导数加总这种比较简单粗暴的方法, NFTGo 可能更文明和精致一些,它是通过算稀有度单个的交并比来得到它的一个差异性,再通过差异性来计算单个NFT 稀有度的统计。

Venus:

The algorithm model of NFTGo for ranking is developed by ourselves which I think is more accurate than the one of Rarity.tools, which is simpler. Our algorithm obtains a difference by calculating the intersection over Union of the single rarity, based on which, and then calculates the single NFT’s rarity.

Nova:

大部分用户可能不是特别容易理解和数学相关的算法和统计,我们可以简单地说明一下用了这样的算法之后,从使用体验或者说从这个结果上面会有什么样的差异吗?

Nova:

Most users may not understand the algorithms and statistics related to mathematics. Can we briefly explain the difference in the user experience or the results after applying such algorithms?

Venus:

结果上是你可以得到 NFT 更精确的稀有度排名。因为算法上的粗暴,会导致精确度的降低。

Venus:

The result is that the NFT ranking is more accurate while the simplicity of algorithms will lead to low accuracy of ranking.

Nova:

假如有一个头像NFT,集中了墨镜、鸭舌帽、香烟等单个稀有元素,当这3种元素在随机结果中大量成组出现,如果不是用NFTGo的算法,是否会导致它的稀有度评级降低?

Nova:

If there is a PFP that involves single rare elements such as sunglasses, caps, and cigarettes, will its rankings be lower if it’s not calculated by the NFTGo algorithm?

Venus:

是的,因为导数加总是一个非常粗暴,也没有赋予人类价值判断的算法,NFTGo的算法是采用量化的方式把一个事物的不同之处与该群体中所有事物进行比较,得出这个事物的稀有度。

Venus:

Yes, because NFTGo’s algorithm compares the differences of an object with all other objects with similarities in a quantitative way to figure out the rarity of the object.

Nova:

所以如果用 NFTGo 这套算法,头部 NFT 稀有度看起来更加的独特。Rarity.tools导数加和这种方式,其实它是一个纯粹的数据,不带任何人类价值选择的结果。但是 NFTGo 的模型会有元素重复度的一个考量。

Nova:

Therefore, if the NFTGo algorithm is used, the rarer NFTs look more unique. Rarity.tools’s algorithm is actually pure data without any human value as the result of selection while NFTGo’s considers repetition.

Venus:

周杰伦站台的Phanta Bear NFT项目,他的稀有度分布模型非常罕见。在NFTGo 稀有度计算排名中,90到100分的NFT一共有6个,70到90 分的NFT有4个,60到70分的NFT有67 个,60分及格线以上一共只有77个,而剩余的 9923 个中间的 5232 个都分布在 0 到 10 分当中。Phanta Bear 稀有度的分布方式可以让头部的NFT去盈利,大量的地板NFT可以让众多用户共同参与,从某种角度来说,这种稀有度分布方式还是非常公平的。

Venus:

The rarity distribution model of Phanta Bear, promoted by Jay Chou’s, is especially unique. According to the rankings calculated by NFTGo, there are 6 bears with 90 to 100 points, 4 bears with 70 to 90 points, 67 bears with 60 to 70 points. So only a total of 77 bears with 60 or above points, while 5,232 bears of the remaining 9,923 got among 0 to 10 points. The distribution of Phanta Bear’s rarity allows the rarest ones to make money, and a large number of normal bears allows the participation of many users. In some ways, this distribution of rarity is quite fair.

Nova:

从整个项目的通盘来考虑来说,这种模型确实是更好的。Phanta Bear并不算是一个类型形式上创新的项目。产品的角度出发,它和传统的 PFP 项目没有特别大的差别,也没有太多新奇的赋能。但是通过这种稀有度分配的方式,可以使头部的利得者快速变成他们的死忠粉,而且这些头部的利得者很多都是 KOL ,这样短期内就使它的项目声量变得非常大。

Nova:

From a project perspective, this model is actually better. From a product standpoint, Phanta Bear is not that different from a traditional PFP project, nor does it have a lot of novel elements. But by applying this rarity allocation, the head winners can quickly become die-hard fans, and many of these head winners are KOLs, which helps the project get under the spotlight in a short time.

Venus:

是的,我们在评估 NFT 的价值的和价格的时候,会评估的一个维度就是趋势价值。它的大部分稀有度是集中在 0 到10,再看它的历史价格,它的最低点是0.2ETH左右,也就是大部分人可以在 0.5 以下的价格买入,当KOL开始宣发或者给项目站台,大部分的用户就成为了流量受益者。当他们把NFT 放入二级市场进行交易,就可以看到这个 NFT 价格已经翻了很多倍。所以这样的稀有度方式是非常普惠的。

Venus:

True. One of the aspects that we consider when assessing an NFT’s value and the price is the value trend. Most of its rarity is between 0 and 10 points. Looking at its historical price, its lowest point is about 0.2ETH, which means that most people can buy it at a price below 0.5. After KOLs promoted this project, from which most floor holders benefited. They could put the bears on the secondary market selling at several times the mint price. So this kind of rarity approach is friendly to holders of both rarer ones and normal ones.

Nova:

是的。其实能够查询稀有度的工具不是特别多,用户对稀有度的认知也没有特别强烈,当市场足够成熟或者说有明确的规则的时候,营销手段和产品设计手段才有可能收到一个比较确切的成效。

Nova:

I see. In fact, there are not many tools that can figure out the rankings, and holders don’t pay much attention to the rarity. When the market is developed or there are clear regulations, marketing methods and product design methods are becoming paramount.

Venus:

刚刚我们回顾了Phanta Bear 的稀有度设定和趋势价值,那么我可以畅想一下,当众多持有者意识到稀有度的重要性的时候,项目方就需要考虑如何通过稀有度设定的运作,让项目方和用户都受益。那 NFTGo 是可为NFT项目方提供稀有度设定模型的咨询服务的,那欢迎大家多和我们交流。

Venus:

We just talked about Phanta Bear’s rarity setting and value trend. When many holders realize the importance of rarity, the project needs to consider how to design a rarity system to benefit both the project team and the communities. NFTGo can provide consulting services to set the model of rarity. Welcome communications.

Nova:

面对冷冰冰的数据,没有接触过数据分析和学习过数据分析相关知识的用户可能无法直接产生价值判断和经验判断。但是如果能从这些角度出发,为项目方或持有者来提供数据分析的话是一件非常有价值的事情。目前数据工具领域缺少了一些主观的声音,且NFT领域在充分地接触人文方面的内容,那么数据分析工具是否也可以带有一些人文的主观的色彩在里面?

Nova:

Faced with raw data, users who have not been exposed to data analysis or learned relevant knowledge may not be able to understand the data to form their judgments. So it’s very valuable to provide data analysis for the project team or holders. At present, the field of data tools lacks some humane elements. Can data analysis tools also include some humane elements?

Venus:

那刚刚有提到的人文色彩,它是指什么?

Venus:

What do you mean by humane elements?

Nova:

我其实从这样两个方向去考虑这个事情。首先是像刚才您说的Phanta Bear稀有度分布,这实际上是商业设计上的问题。商业设计是一个带有主观判断意味的东西。你说他是人文,他也算不上,但是他确实具有主观性。至于说我们狭义的纯粹人文的话,那比如说像反映美国摇滚文化的在pop music 或者说是 rap,从北美市场看,它可能不是很稀有,但放眼全球,从供求关系来看,他可能处在一个供小于求的关系。

Nova:

There are two aspects. The first is that the Phanta Bear’s rarity model as you mentioned earlier, which is actually a kind of commercial design. You can say that design is subject to some extent while not a humane thing. As for the pure humanities in a narrow sense, for example, pop music or rap, which reflects the American rock culture, may not be very rare in the North American market. However, from the perspective of supply and demand worldwide, I think supply is less than demand.

Venus:

那我们怎么样能够去衡量这些东西呢?你是觉得要有人来打分吗?还是要有人评价。

Venus:

Then how can we measure these things? Do you think should there be someone to assess it?

Nova:

我个人认为可能需要引入能够批判、鉴赏或者是介绍人的这样一个角色,他对这个文化圈层有了解,他了解这个文化圈层的消费能力和购买欲望。

Nova:

I think it may be necessary to introduce a role that can appreciate or introduce NFTs. This man must have an understanding of this culture, consumption power and purchasing desire of ppl from that culture.

Venus:

这就是有各种各样不同的施工方式,需要知道喜欢这类NFT的人有多少,分布在什么区域等等,再根据不同的主观因素,进行权重的设定,最后再进行评分。

Venus:

Yes, this means the role should know this business in many ways. They need to know how many people like this kind of NFT, where are they from, et cetera. Then, according to different subjective factors, the weight is set before final assessments.

Nova:

对于human factor 实际上我们是无法穷尽的,甚至无法对已经列举的 human factor 中每一个 factor 它的权重进行估算。呈现总体数据的时候,就呈现一个纯粹数据的整体数据,其他的内容用图表或者说是文字的形式作为判断的辅助选品。在排名评分下方,还能发现它过往的交易者,还可以显示交易过的项目,可能还会有若干个鉴赏人对某一个特定元素文化符号进行那些解释,做出一些市场意见。通过这样的形式把信息充分暴露给消费者,让消费者能够更全面地了解。

Nova:

Actually, we cannot consider every human factor or even estimate the weight of each factor listed. I think what we can do now is to display an NFT’s past holders, other NFTs these past holders have traded, and interpretations of a particular element’s cultural meaning by several connoisseurs as well as some market opinions. In this way, consumers are exposed fully to information related to that NFT so that they can see the whole picture.

Venus:

对,这个非常有意思,但在这之前需要引入负责审查制度。

Venus:

Oh, this is very interesting while censorship is also necessary.

社区成员:

未来会有付费服务吗?会有哪些与众不同的服务?

Community members:

Will there be fee-based services in the future and what special services will be offered?

Venus:

我们暂时不会提供付费服务,因为就像我们的那个 slogan 标语一样,我们想做到的是最大的一个 NFT 的平台。我们会把 rarity 和巨鲸排名,做到精做到细。比如说我们刚刚升级的这个巨鲸追踪功能,你可以追踪到近一个小时之内哪些巨鲸做过的交易,可以让这些交易更有时效性。当距今上个小时他买了一些非常大家能够接受的低价位的 NFT 时,我们可以立马跟进买入。

Venus:

We don’t provide fee-based services in the near future, we are focusing on becoming the largest NFT platform just like our slogan says. We will improve the accuracy and timeliness of our services. The whale tracking function upgraded lately, for example, allows you to track what transactions whales made for the last hour. What we are doing is providing those data faster so that our users can make transactions at a lower price.

社区成员:

还有没有尽可能多的维度的数据?NFTGo未来是怎样的发展走向?

Community members:

Will there be more dimensions of data? Where does NFTGo go?

Venus:

我们会做成一个多维度的平台。我们的终极目标,是想做一个 NFT 的估价平台,这需要大量的数据来获得算法和模型。

Venus:

We will make a multi-dimensional platform. Our final mission is to build an NFT assessment platform, which requires a lot of data to create algorithms and models.

社区成员:

注意到forgotten wizards和10knft没有Rarity的标签,可以解释下么?

Community members:

We have noticed that Forgotten Wizards and some 10k NFT don’t have a Rarity tag, can you explain that?

Venus:

有一些项目如果它没有 Rarity 标签的话,就说明项目方没有把这个标签的数据开源,所以我们无法抓取。

Venus:

If a project does not have a Rarity tag, it indicates that the source is not open, so the tag data cannot be retrieved.

社区成员:

和Rarity 相关的另外一个mirror world是Rarity分布是双峰分布的,有些其他的NFT项目也是这样,这个设计有什么说法?

Community members:

The mirror world related to the rarity distribution is bimodal, as are some other NFT projects. Why is that?

Venus:

刚刚有个朋友问 Rarity 相关的另外一个 Mirror word 对 Mirror word 是 Rarity 投资的另外一个项目导出物体分布是双峰公布的。至于设计这个问题有点过于学术,我暂时没有办法回答。

Venus:

About the mirror world, I’m sorry it is too academic for me to answer.

社区成员:

目前NFTGo目前有多少用户? 因为我认为nft的价值主要体在稀有度分数是否有更多的用户认可。如果对比其他稀有度工具时有较大差异的话,用户购买nft时应该如何做决策?

Community members:

How many users does NFTGo currently have? I think the value of NFTs mainly lies in whether the rarity score is recognized by most users. How should users make decisions when buying NFTs if there is a significant difference compared to other rarity tools?

Venus:

我实际上大部分我们有做过一些对比,大部分的数据是相似的,它会体现在一些比较小部分的差异化。在我们的官方的文章里面有披露的Jaccard Distance模型,它把相似性用整体的交集和并集来体现,那他的差异性就是用 1 减去他的相似性。所以我认为这样的一个数学的公式来表达差异性和相似性,得出的稀有度是更精确的。

Venus:

I actually compared most of the data, they are quite similar. In our official articles, we have disclosed the Jaccard Distance model, which reflects similarity by the intersection and union of the whole. Then, its difference is to subtract its similarity by 1. Therefore, I think such a mathematical formula to express the difference and similarity, the obtained rarity is more accurate.

Nova:

实际上用户对于 rarity 排名,想要的其实是一个标。当一个标准出现了之后,用户不会去关注这个标准是否是正确的。这个角度上来讲的话,只要有一个标准,它就能完成估价进入。而这个估价是否被别人认可,是取决于其他人是否也认可这个标准。所以从这个角度上来看的话,Rarity.tools 它作为更早地进入这个领域制定标准的这一个项目方,它在这的优势是无法撼动的场面。

Nova:

In fact, what users want about ranking is actually a standard. When a standard appears, users don’t care if it’s correct. As long as there is a standard that can complete the valuation. And whether this valuation is accepted by others depends on whether others also accept this standard. So, Rarity.Tools, started early in this field, is hard to beat.

社区成员:

将来河里人可以跨链去到一些土地项目里展示吗?比如flow 和solana。

Community members:

Will Rivermen be able to be displayed on other chains such as Flow and Solana in the future?

Nova:

其实我们可以花点时间更深入地讨论一下 ERC 721 ,包括更广义上的 NFT, 我们可能也包含 ERC 1155 。

在我看来,ERC 721 虽然说解决了流通的问题,但是它没有流通上的共识问题.它没有解决另外一个问题就是具象物。无论是图片也好,音乐也好,模型也好,它会存在一些具象物呈现的技术标准问题。比如说我们说 JPEG 实际上是目前来看流通范围最广的图片格式标准,但是我们仍然能看到大量的其他的格式。

在图片设计领域,我们经常会使用这个 PNG, 因为 PNG 包含透明通道。然后在更多的设计领域,我们甚至还会使用矢量图。我们可以看到资产在数字世界流通使用的时候,因为存在着不同的技术标准,使得每一类资产它的使用场景受到了一定的限制。所以河里人在这边的解决方案就是我们会使用最主流的资产格式去储存。

如果说这个项目方他不是很标新立意,或者说他不是跨链,本身愿意给自己造轮子,已经更多采用了一些前人的编程经验的话,那么这些被更广泛认可的数据标准就可以跨平台跨产品的流通起来。跨链实际上已经出现了大量的解决方案,从另外一个角度上来讲,就算是一个以太坊的 NFT 它跨链到solana。如果solana上没有对应的NFT 的落地场景,或者说使用环境的话,其实是没有用的。

那么从河里人角度来说,我们是可以支持去其他跨链平台上使用的,目前我们也在大量地接触其他项目

Nova:

Rivermen can be displayed on other cross-chain platforms. At present, we are trying to collaborate with a lot of other projects.

社区用户:

地皮的稀有度基本上都是以主观判断为主,通过算法计算的稀有度的能不能套用到这个地皮上?

Community members:

The rarity of land is basically based on subjective judgment. Can the rarity be calculated?

Venus:

目前还没有地皮稀有度的算法,因为这就像买房一样,你得考虑很多因素,像周围的环境,像The sandbox, DCL 这些地块的评判标准是不一样的,有一些是中间不能有任何的间隔,有一些它是你必须得在一个中间的位置。所以地皮的稀有度目前还无法计算。

Venus:

There is currently no algorithm for ranking a piece of land because there are many factors you have to consider when you are buying a house such as the surrounding environment. The Sandbox and Decentraland’s standards of assessing lands are different. So the rare level of land cannot be calculated yet.

社区成员:

地皮上的建筑以后是不是可以多维度地区进行一些评判,会不会有一些评判标准?

Community members:

Will there be more dimensions, based on which, to assess buildings on the land?

Nova:

一些人可能知道河里人的母公司是蓬莱,蓬莱还有另外一块业务是蓬莱设计。蓬莱设计是云宇宙建筑事务所,蓬莱设计还有一个子公司叫蓬莱咨询。蓬莱咨询未来会在自己发布渠道持续具象地输出一些发展云宇宙建筑批评,我们会在每个周期里面去筛选一些在元宇宙中建成的建筑。对建筑多个维度去进行内容的输出,比如说实用性、美观以及业态发展以及持续运营质量。

再说回对建筑或是地块的评论见解,它并不能以很数据化的方式呈现出来,这中间会因为数据化丧失掉一些主观评判或者说情感上的一些色彩。但是我们在进行审美考量的时候,这部分东西是无法去除的,是不能去除。你一旦去除了审美考量本身不成立,所以也可以辅助一些。

Nova:

The value of a building or a piece of land cannot be presented by data that cannot present aesthetic value.

社区成员:

马路边上、连片的土地是不是会更有价值?

Community members:

Is the land next to a road and the land with a large area more valuable?

Nova:

一开始大家觉得马路边上的更高价值,这个直觉其实是对的。但是你忽略了一个前提,就是虚拟世界中的人既不走路也不开车,他们直接点对点传送,所以大家不能用传统买房的观点带入到元宇宙中。

Nova:

In real life, it’s true that roadside land is more valuable. However, people in the virtual world don’t walk or drive, they teleport. So this theory can not apply to the Metaverse.

社区成员:

虚拟画廊未来的机会大吗?

Community members:

Do virtual galleries have a bright future?

Nova;

当我们说出虚拟画廊四个字的时候,它的机会就已经不大了,因为你的虚拟画廊的四个字里面包含了画廊,那么画廊我们知道它是一个在现实领域里面的体验。我之前在给巴比特那边做一个分享的时候,我说过一个事,就是如果你试图把传统的一个商业模式搬到 web 3 点数据里面的话,其实你成功的概率会相对比较低。第一点是有跟你相似想法的人一定不会太少,而这块的技术门槛本身就不是特别高。第二从消费者领域来讨论,实际上同样的体验如果我在线下也能完成的话,那么线上体验的独特性在哪里?体验为什么要二选一的时候选择?选择上的优势被弱化了。如果我们能强化这个选择,可以给他提供 AR 在线下根本无法达成的体验的话,那当然是没有问题。那当然就在虚拟世界里面找到了自己的历史点。比如装置艺术、交互艺术等,它原生的世界中会更有利于它的展示。

所以与其说它是一个虚拟画廊,不如把它变成一个虚拟艺术体验馆,我提供的是体验,我可能更希望获得的是在这个空间中与艺术家或者是艺术家的艺术品完成共同的艺术体验,一种交互的这种形式的东西,可能这个东西在虚拟世界中是更有优势的。但如果说你仅仅是把一个 JPG 贴在虚拟世界的墙上,之后让参观者去参观的话,那可能他整个叙事上面就没有那么性感。

Nova:

One of the things I said when I was doing a share for Bybit is that if you’re trying to take a traditional business model into the Web3.0 world, you will probably fail. Firstly, there will be many people with similar ideas because the technical threshold of this area is low. Secondly, for consumers, if they can do the same thing offline with a better experience, why will they choose to do it in the Metaverse.

It’s more an art experience center than a virtual gallery. What it provides is the experience of interacting with arts which works better in the Metaverse than in the real life. But if you just stick a JPG on the wall in a virtual world, it’s not that attractive then.

社区成员:

机构基于数据属性做了稀有度,但是有些 NFT项目它还附加了其他的玩法属性,比如说河里人,僧人的稀有度是最高的,但是像NFTGo里是没有体现这个数据的,未来这些信息可能只有项目深度用户才能了解,NFTGo是否会引入除纯属性数据之外的数据?

Institutions rank NFTs based on data and some of the projects added other properties. Rivermen’s monks, for example, are the rarest while NFTGo did not show this on their website. Only those who dived into the project noticed that monks are more valuable. Will NFTGo introduce property data in the future?

Nova:

这是我故意留的一个小设计,无法用数据工具统计,用户只能去研究,去深度参与。

Nova:

This is designed intentionally by me, which cannot be counted by data tools. Only by studying the project deeply can they find out it.

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Rivermen NFT
Rivermen NFT

Written by Rivermen NFT

Blind boxes based on the voxel version of the famous ancient Chinese painting “Along the River During the Qingming Festival”

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